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Occasional Poster
Memetic
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎29-05-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

Vodafone telephone support today confirmed the following vague information by text:

latest Software for Nokia N900. should be proofed from Vodafone. in a next Couple ofweeks.
Message 61 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Peer IV
Sticky_Mick
Posts: 1,177
Registered: ‎11-02-2009

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

That doesn't tell us a heck of a lot.

Unless they started the whole "testing" process from scratch when PR1.2 was released instead of carrying on with V1.1.1, then it's going to be V1.1.1 that's going to be released. Still no good to people wanting to get back on Ovi Store, and still more and more those Extras app updates will keep failing.
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Once in a while I drift in time. To a place in my memory where it still hurts to find
I was takin' on the World with a see through smile. But dyin' on the inside all the while
I was dyin' on the inside all the while.
Message 62 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Occasional Poster
Memetic
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎29-05-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

Quite, and that info was after originally being told by the same person that they had no timescale, hence me asking for a text to confirm his statement that the update would be out in two weeks.
Message 63 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Established Poster
tangray1
Posts: 28
Registered: ‎13-03-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

Hey guys I`m as fed up with this as you are so I went down to my local nokia care center asked if they could put the latest firmware on for me no probs he said, went for a brew 30 mins later sorted ! on the way home i got a OTA for 1.2 happy days...

Message 64 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Occasional Poster
Memetic
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎29-05-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

Ok, looks like we are being censored, I have posted twice to say that I have complained to a public body responsible for trading standards about this issue and twice the post has disappeared.

Vodafone - when using social media it is important to have transparency, please at least have the courage to show when a post has been censored and provide reasons for doing so.
Message 65 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Established Poster
Mad-Halfling
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎02-05-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


Hi

So I just spoke to Vodafone regarding whether upgrading to PR 1.2 will invalidate my warranty and the lady tells me that it's fine to do so as my warranty is with Nokia and not Vodafone. She also assured me that the firmware running on my N900 was in fact, "Vodafone-modified" software and even though, according to the Nokia software update website, my current supported version is : 1.2009.42.11 (I'm currently running 2.2009.51), it's okay to update.


To coin a phrase re: Vodafone, does the left hand know what the right hand is doing?

Why can't they be more open re: firmware?


In case you didn't know, you do have 2 warranties (probably, depending on where you got your phone), one with Vodafone and one with Nokia. If you update to a Nokia-based firmware (revision 203 rather than 205) this should void your VF warranty but not Nokia's.

And yeah, there doesn't seem to be a whole load on conflicts in what different people say, even different posts by admin on this forum, sometimes.
Message 66 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Regular Poster
Tanthalas
Posts: 325
Registered: ‎11-05-2009

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


Good point, Memetic.

Are you aware that there is free software available from Maemo extras that allows you to add a new boot animation alongside the handshake?

I've done it and it only took less than 5 minutes to do.


Sounds interesting Sticky, what is it called? I am probably being blind but cant seem to find anything like that.
Message 67 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Regular Poster
aquestion
Posts: 149
Registered: ‎23-09-2008

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

As the thread I asked this question was closed and asked to to refer to one of the three threads still open. I will ask it again as i recieved no answer in that thread.

Intresting points and it does seem that because we bought exactly the same device as others in the eyes of a layman we are now disadvatnaged for the forseeable future and unable to use a device as the rest of the world can which was advertised as open source and Vodafone were not locking down..

Can the Vodafone Admins inform us that Trading standards would not have an issue with this sort of behaviour where because i bought off vodafone direct and not carphone warehouse, nokia or mobile direct my use of the product is impeded?

I would like an answer and no please dont refer to the firmware post we have all read that.

Thank you
Message 68 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Peer IV
Sticky_Mick
Posts: 1,177
Registered: ‎11-02-2009

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


Sounds interesting Sticky, what is it called? I am probably being blind but cant seem to find anything like that.


It's called "Bootscreen Manager" and can be found in Extras-devel. Basically it allows you to change your bootscreen animation to any .avi video instead of the default Nokia handshake.

Currently I'm using this one: N900 custom bootscreen. There's others that are available and the guys at maemo.org have been pretty busy too: Maemo.org Bootscreens.
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Once in a while I drift in time. To a place in my memory where it still hurts to find
I was takin' on the World with a see through smile. But dyin' on the inside all the while
I was dyin' on the inside all the while.
Message 69 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Regular Poster
Tanthalas
Posts: 325
Registered: ‎11-05-2009

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


It's called "Bootscreen Manager" and can be found in Extras-devel. Basically it allows you to change your bootscreen animation to any .avi video instead of the default Nokia handshake.

Currently I'm using this one: N900 custom bootscreen. There's others that are available and the guys at maemo.org have been pretty busy too: Maemo.org Bootscreens.


Thanks and that would explain why I couldn't find it, for some reason I didnt have extras-devel in my catalogues anymore although extras-testing was still there! Downloading it now to have a play, nothing better to do at work today anyway haha
Message 70 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Moderator (Retired)
Daz_V
Posts: 5,931
Registered: ‎04-08-2008

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

Hi aquestion.

Can the Vodafone Admins inform us that Trading standards would not have an issue with this sort of behaviour where because i bought off vodafone direct and not carphone warehouse, nokia or mobile direct my use of the product is impeded?


We obviously can't comment for trading standards of course, but we have not done anything illegal. I can 100% assure you this - if you don't believe me, you're welcome to contact trading standards yourself. Also, your product is not impeded - an update will arrive as soon as we can authorize it.

We already have identified the problem and are already doing our very best to come to a resolution, your patience is appreciated.



Daz

eForum Team
Want to give me some feedback? Yes
Message 71 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Regular Poster
aquestion
Posts: 149
Registered: ‎23-09-2008

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


Hi aquestion.



We obviously can't comment for trading standards of course, but we have not done anything illegal. I can 100% assure you this - if you don't believe me, you're welcome to contact trading standards yourself. Also, your product is not impeded - an update will arrive as soon as we can authorize it.

We already have identified the problem and are already doing our very best to come to a resolution, your patience is appreciated.



Daz

eForum Team


Thank you Daz so now we know a Update will come. We now also know Daz is a legal expert I never stated Vodafone had done something ilegal did I?

Please remeber that a N900 is a Tablet pc with a Phone function which is how nokia market it. so if Vodafone were unable to provide the major firmware updates issued by Nokia and the phone was unable to work as nokia intended IE unable to accept Firmware updates. As so much of the software written for the N900 moves to use resources which need the PR1.2 the device is no longer in my point of view fit for purpose..

So good to read we will have the firmware update and that its only a matter of time..



But if further Major updates are created by Nokia for the entire market of course we hope even when the N900 is discontinued we will see updates provided by Vodafone or find we users have no issues with Vodafone reflashing to the 203 version if your company due to the massive cuts its having to make as many companies are at present cant afford to carry on supporting new firmware versions for 205..



Trading Standards

We approached the Trading Standards regarding the contract and sales of goods act issues and Mr David Sanders, Vice Chairman of the Trading Standards Institute said, When purchasing the telephone, there are two elements to the contract. First is the provision of the service by the air time provider, and the second is the actual hand set (goods). Both elements, services and goods, are covered by the different consumer legislation....

If a customer went to a shop (or used the telephone sales), stating where they were going to use the phone and they were told that the phone will work as specified by the manufacturer then this enhances the consumer's rights (fitness for purpose)....

If the phone then does not work, the consumer should take it back and ask for either the cancellation of the contract (where there is in fact no network coverage), or for a replacement phone of the similar specification if the hand set is faulty. Failure to supply goods that are of satisfactory quality (fit for purpose) and corresponding with the given description is a breach of the consumer's statutory rights and can be remedied by money back, repair or replacement. Where a repair or replacement is sought there is no need to prove the fault within six months of purchase. Thereafter consumer’s rights of redress last for up to six years but proof of fault may be needed....

With a service contract failure to provide the service from the outset is a fundamental breach of the contract and the consumer could end the contract and get back all monies paid. Intermittent failures of service may give rise to a valid claim for compensation for a pro rata payment for loss of air time....

Shops sometimes give customers certain time limits to return goods for a refund or replacement. Such time limits must not appear to restrict the consumer's statutory rights as to do so could be classed an offence which local trading standards departments will investigate if it is reported to them" .
Message 72 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Occasional Poster
Memetic
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎29-05-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

@Daz_Vodafone I agree, vodafone has not done anything illegal, however, as per the post above, and the response to my enqiry to Consumer Direct on this issue, which is posted below, Vodafone may very likley be in breach of contract. A civil rather than criminal matter.

I am posting the response from Consumer Direct as this constitutes advice, which is allowed as per Vodafone's email to me when my earlier post was censored. On that matter I have to say it is somewhat insulting the intelligence of your valued customers to suggest that we would be confused by seeing an alternative means of complaint and redress over this issue. I am sure we could all cope with the concept of a parallel compalint to a regulator or trading standards body while we wait for vodafone to properly respond to complaints here.

Memetic.

---
In response to me outlining the current situatuation over with the n900 software for Vodafone's direct customers Consumer Direct replied:
Thank you for your email to Consumer Direct dated 01/06/2010 regarding the faulty a copy of which is attached. I am sorry to hear you are disappointed with the service you have received.

Form the information that you have provided it would appear that you have entered into a legally binding contract, this would be subject to the terms and conditions within the contract.

As Vodafone are providing the service side of your contract, you can potentially argue that they are in Breach of Contract if you are now unable to access certain applications that were originally available to you.

If a breach of contract has occurred this would entitle you to seek a remedy, and you could look to give Vodafone an opportunity to provide this software so that you can again access the full range of services.

If they will not or cannot do this, you may then be in a position to look to terminate your contract without penalty.

As a next practical step, I would advise that you write Vodafone, sending the letter by recorded delivery and setting a reasonable deadline for a response. You should also keep a copy of the letter for your own records. I have attached a template letter that I hope you will find useful.

(See attached file: Guidance notes on using template letters.doc)(See attached file: Breach of Contract.doc)

I hope this information is useful however, please do not hesitate to contact us on 08454 04 05 06 should you have any further queries.

Your reference number for this case is EE-CC-********* and should be quoted in all further correspondence regarding this case.

Thank you for your enquiry.

Kind regards

***
Senior Advisor
Consumer Direct


The template letter reffered to says:

Personal name/Address details
Date…….


Owner / Managers name (or The Manager)

Retailer’s name

Retailer’s address

Retailer’s postcode



Dear

I entered into an agreement with your company on . At the time of purchase I was advised by your representative that the service/goods would include:


This term is an essential part of the contract and to date has not been fulfilled. I am requesting your company to honour the contract within 14 days from the date of this letter. Otherwise I will have no option but to cancel the contract without incurring penalties.


Therefore I would request a refund of any costs incurred arising from your breach



I look forward to your response within the 14 day deadline in order to resolve this matter amicably.


Yours sincerely/yours faithfully







(Edited to remove some rogue HTML that crept in with the cut and paste)
Message 73 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Moderator (Retired)
Daz_V
Posts: 5,931
Registered: ‎04-08-2008

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

Guys,

I appreciate the concern here - we all do here at eForum Towers and have passed all info to our teams working on it. I'm not here to argue with anyone, but simply to let you know that we completely acknowledge what has happened and are moving to a resolution - it's just a matter of time. I know this is frustrating / annoying / disappointing, but we are going to get it resolved!



Daz

eForum Team
Want to give me some feedback? Yes
Message 74 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Scout I
Rusty5010
Posts: 120
Registered: ‎07-06-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

Posted 05 June 2010 - 02:16 PM

Guys,

I appreciate the concern here - we all do here at eForum Towers and have passed all info to our teams working on it. I'm not here to argue with anyone, but simply to let you know that we completely acknowledge what has happened and are moving to a resolution - it's just a matter of time. I know this is frustrating / annoying / disappointing, but we are going to get it resolved!



Daz

eForum Team
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Want to give me some feedback? Yes




Well, any movement yet?
Message 75 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Occasional Poster
t1ddo
Posts: 9
Registered: ‎03-12-2008

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

if all of the above statements are true then daz,,,,i hope vodafone will be giving us a credit note for lost time while we wait for the update ,,,,,,,,,,,,(ummmmm i think not )
Message 76 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Peer V
Johnmcl7
Posts: 1,936
Registered: ‎14-06-2008

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


Guys,

I appreciate the concern here - we all do here at eForum Towers and have passed all info to our teams working on it. I'm not here to argue with anyone, but simply to let you know that we completely acknowledge what has happened and are moving to a resolution - it's just a matter of time. I know this is frustrating / annoying / disappointing, but we are going to get it resolved!



Daz

eForum Team

I really think a little more caution is required, aside from your previous post getting people's backs up with a highly dubious comment on legality I think it's also hard to argue it was technically correct - application access has become a central component of a modern smartphone and therefore it's reasonable to say that losing that function impedes the phone as has happened with the Vodafone N900's.  If Iphone owners lost access to the app store or Android owners the Android market that would also count as impeding those phones which I'm sure people would be vocal about.

John 
Knowledge is power, guard it well
Message 77 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Established Poster
Mad-Halfling
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎02-05-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


It's called "Bootscreen Manager" and can be found in Extras-devel. Basically it allows you to change your bootscreen animation to any .avi video instead of the default Nokia handshake.

Currently I'm using this one: N900 custom bootscreen. There's others that are available and the guys at maemo.org have been pretty busy too: Maemo.org Bootscreens.


That's a nice anim, Sticky, esp the open text at the end - have you still got the source URL for the .avi pls?
Cheers
MH
Message 78 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Peer IV
Sticky_Mick
Posts: 1,177
Registered: ‎11-02-2009

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?

I actually downloaded it from Youtube as an avi. But he's got his own channel here: Gixer 7502's channel.
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
Once in a while I drift in time. To a place in my memory where it still hurts to find
I was takin' on the World with a see through smile. But dyin' on the inside all the while
I was dyin' on the inside all the while.
Message 79 of 163 (19,669 Views)
Established Poster
Mad-Halfling
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎02-05-2010

Nokia N900 - Should 205 Handset Owners Have An Option To Download PR1.2?


I actually downloaded it from Youtube as an avi. But he's got his own channel here: Gixer 7502's channel.


Cheers - is there a legit way of doing that or did you just use one of the YT "ripping" sites?
Message 80 of 163 (19,669 Views)