Vodafone Sure Signal

[markchristou]

Dear Experts,

I hope you can help.

My SS seems to keep dropping the signal and connection to its server. I have both the power and @ lights on all the time, so an internet connection is there but then the bottom light just goes out.

I was wondering if it was some form of timeout issue. I performed a tracert to 212.183.133.177 and get the following results:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms Router
2 5 ms 5 ms 7 ms 10.213.4.1
3 6 ms 9 ms 9 ms watf-cam-1a-ge95.network.virginmedia.net
4 6 ms 7 ms 8 ms watf-core-1a-ge-011-0.network.virginmedia.net
5 10 ms 13 ms 8 ms brnt-bb-1a-ge-320-0.network.virginmedia.net
6 17 ms 32 ms 17 ms TenGigabitEthernet8-3.ar4.AMS2.gblx.net
7 39 ms 30 ms 29 ms VODAFONE-LTD.TenGigabitEthernet7-1.ar6.LON3.gblx
.net
8 * * * Request timed out.
9 * * * Request timed out.
10 * * * Request timed out.
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 * * * Request timed out.
14 * * * Request timed out.
15 * * * Request timed out.
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.


The strange thing is if I perform a full reset of the SS (hold down the reset button plug the power back in) it will then fully reconnect back to its server and 3G service is resumed (for a bit) until it drops the connection again. So once the SS has timed out just it just 'give up' until I perform a full reset when it then starts trying again?

What I don't understand is if I am getting the timeouts above, why when I reset the SS does it actually connect?

Any ideas are very welcome as if I cannot resolve this I will be forced to send it back

Cheers,

Kandinsky

[George]

Hi Kandinsky,

Firstly, a very warm welcome to the eForum Family, it's always great to see new faces on here .

I can imagine this must be a rather frustrating issue for you so I'd like to help you out. The reason why the bottom light keeps going out will be down to an NTP (Network Time Protocol) issue. Basically, in order for the Sure Signal to ensure it is broadcasting 3G signal at the correct frequency it will send tiny data packets to an NTP server at regular intervals. If it takes longer than 240ms for the packet to be sent and received back then it will stop broadcasting 3G signal. Usually, this is caused by latency on your broadband connection. If the problem persists then I would recommend contacting your ISP (Internet Service Provider) so that they can check your connection for any fluctuations in latency.

In regards to the Traceroute you've posted above. Traceroutes will always time out when reaching our network simply because it doesn't allow traceroutes to respond so I wouldn't worry about that.

George
eForum Team

[markchristou]

Hi Kandinsky,

Firstly, a very warm welcome to the eForum Family, it's always great to see new faces on here .

I can imagine this must be a rather frustrating issue for you so I'd like to help you out. The reason why the bottom light keeps going out will be down to an NTP (Network Time Protocol) issue. Basically, in order for the Sure Signal to ensure it is broadcasting 3G signal at the correct frequency it will send tiny data packets to an NTP server at regular intervals. If it takes longer than 240ms for the packet to be sent and received back then it will stop broadcasting 3G signal. Usually, this is caused by latency on your broadband connection. If the problem persists then I would recommend contacting your ISP (Internet Service Provider) so that they can check your connection for any fluctuations in latency.

In regards to the Traceroute you've posted above. Traceroutes will always time out when reaching our network simply because it doesn't allow traceroutes to respond so I wouldn't worry about that.

George
eForum Team

Thanks George. On the questions of latency, have you seen this problem with other customers who are using Virgin Media over cable?

[richardski]

8 * * * Request timed out.


The strange thing is if I perform a full reset of the SS (hold down the reset button plug the power back in) it will then fully reconnect back to its server and 3G service is resumed (for a bit) until it drops the connection again. So once the SS has timed out just it just 'give up' until I perform a full reset when it then starts trying again?

What I don't understand is if I am getting the timeouts above, why when I reset the SS does it actually connect?

Any ideas are very welcome as if I cannot resolve this I will be forced to send it back

Cheers,

Kandinsky

Hi Kandinsky

Seems NTP is major feature in some of these problems. I my be useful to check the performance of the Vodafone NTP servers:

NTP on UDP-123 to 212.183.133.181 - primary - GPS referenced
NTP on UDP-123 to 212.183.133.182 - secondary

when you experience a loss VSS connectivity. Unfortunately you cannot ping these IPs as ICMP PING is stopped at the Vodafone/Global Crossing Gateway. You can make valid NTP requests of these servers using the below free utilities which will provide you with performance stats as well:

NTP monitors

Galleon - simple and basic:
http://www.ntp-time-server.com/ntp-server-tool.html

Meinberg - more comprehensive with graphing capabilities:
http://www.meinberg.de/english/sw/time-server-monitor.htm

Both companies manufacture NTP servers.


Your path to the Global Crossing/Vodafone handoff gateway is good and very few hops compared to some we have seen. So it would be interesting to see if the actual NTP servers are performing adequately in response to your reqests.

From George:

If the NTP ping does take longer than 240ms then the Sure Signal won't automatically recover, you'll just need to restart the unit.


Once you have re-started it manually it will run until the next timeout which could be the next time somthing like peer to peer sharing, TV catchup , off site backups hog the ADSL bandwdith.

If you are able to set Quality of Service on your router to give priority to the VSS traffic that would help a great deal.

Regards

Richard





Regards

Richard

[George]

Hi Kandisky,

Thank you for replying. I have heard of this happening to other users, I wouldn't say it's happening with any one specific ISP though. As Richard advises, common causes can be video streaming, peer to peer downloading/uploading. I would definitely recommend contacting your ISP who will be able to check on this for you.

George
eForum Team

[uno]

Well it does appear that quite a few customers who have Virgin media cable broadband are having problems with poor voice quality and signal dropping off even though like myself they have plenty of available bandwith 20mb down and 740 upstream so I am wondering if Virgin medias traffic management systems are having an effect as I have heard it inspects all packets of data

[richardski]

Well it does appear that quite a few customers who have Virgin media cable broadband are having problems with poor voice quality and signal dropping off even though like myself they have plenty of available bandwith 20mb down and 740 upstream so I am wondering if Virgin medias traffic management systems are having an effect as I have heard it inspects all packets of data

Hi uno,

If your ISP appears to be promoting downloads of purchasable entertainment then its a fair assumption that they have tailored their network to prefer download services over any uploads.

A question you could ask of them.

Regards

Richard

[Sie]

After over a year with my SureSignal working reasonably well, I now have the same problem, as others here.

I have tested the NTP servers at 212.183.133.181 and 212.183.133.182 with the tool suggested by richardski and both reply within 30ms or so.
However, my SureSignal is not using those two, but is using 212.183.131.132 and 88.82.13.173 and I can see with Wireshark that it does not recieve a reply from either of these servers!

So basically after a reset, the thing works for a few minutes and then the bottom LED goes off. The power and "@" LEDs stay lit.
I have tried a factory reset and deregistering and re-registering the box several times, but still the problem persists.

[lienyingp]

I would definitely recommend contacting your ISP who will be able to check on this for you.

[James]

Hi Sie,

Thanks for your post here.

To be honest this issue is quite rare however, so that we can investigate this for you please can you let me know the following;

Who is your ISP?

How long does the connection last?

What router are you using?

What are the results of your speed test when it is working and when it is not?

What is your Sure Signal serial number?

James