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When is a warranty not a warranty?

PaulSalk
4: Newbie

Way back in April, my daughter's iPhone 4, supposedly new less than a year previously, had problems. Since that time I have had and continue to have really major problems with getting vodafone's attention.

 

On Friday, I wasted another hour on the phone with someone from Customer Support. I have repeatedly been misinformed, and it appears that my initial attempts to lodge a complaint were blocked (I was told that this was only possible in a letter). So here is the letter I sent;

 

Customer Relations

Vodafone House

The Connection

Newbury,

Berkshire RG14 2FN

 

Dear Sir/Madam

I am writing to complain about (1) a faulty phone which should have been repaired under warranty and (2) the appalling customer service I have received.

My daughter’s phone (which is on my account)*specified in original* .This is an iphone4 bought, as we understood it, new. I had several problems, particularly that the internal earpiece did not work. It appeared loose, and I took it into Vodafone Bath, pointing out where we could see that the piece had come loose. They said, after a very long wait, that as it was still under warranty from Apple and I should take it to the Apple store. After a further very long wait, they said that the warranty was not valid as it had clearly been opened and “several components were missing”. They said that they thought it was a reconditioned unit, which would explain the changed. In any case, they would not honour the warranty, so I returned to Vodafone Bath. After a very long wait again, I explained this, and it was duly sent to your central engineering facility. After a greater than expected delay and a message being sent to the phone in your possession (despite my asking for messages to be sent to me). I was told that the engineers report (enclosed) indicated mechanical damage and therefore it was not covered by the warranty. The engineer apparently suggested that it may have been “sat on”. They included a photo (enclosed) which showed what we had originally drawn attention to. I pointed out that the unit was immaculate, that it was kept in my daughter’s handbag, there was no sign of external damage or distortion consistent with impact etc etc. To no avail. Eventually, the shop agreed to take the issue up with the repairing engineer, and an email was sent and I was copied into the email. You will see from the enclosed that this was a further series of nothing happening, and as I understand it from the most recent email, not likely to! In that it was suggested I take it up with Customer services, which I had done so previously. Fiona in customer services on 27th June said that she could do nothing because she had no records of my contact with the shop in Bath. After I pressed her, she looked into it and as far as a I could determine spoke with someone in enginerring, coming back with the previous line that as there allegedly was mechanical damage this voided the warranty. However, I could have it repaired for £300! After a protracted discussion which essentially went round and round the same script, I decided to make it a formal complaint and indicated this to her. She said that this could only be done in writing. I asked about email etc, but she was adamant that it had to be in writing which I found both odd and basically obstructive.

I have looked carefully at your complaints policy; your website says something rather different:

“If you're not happy with our service and would like to make a complaint, there are a number of ways to get in touch outlined below. (note: this as go into a shop or call 191) We aim to resolve all issues on first contact, but if we cannot we will escalate your call to a team manager. If the team manager cannot resolve the issue we will refer it to our dedicated customer relations team. In any event we will endeavour to resolve any complaint within one week. If we are unable to do so, we will notify you and provide weekly updates on progress”

Now I’m afraid that that was not what has happened here, so I suggest that as a matter of priority you change your website or retrain your staff.

I pay a great deal of money to your company and really don’t expect this kind of repeated fobbing off. I have also wasted an amazing amount of my time on this issue. Perhaps I should bill you for this?

I would be most grateful if you would deal with this as a formal complaint about (1) the handset which has now been unavailable to us for many months and (2) the really bad customer services provided both in shop and on the phone.

I look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience.

Professor PS***

Then I waited. No reply. just over two weeks from the letter being sent, I called 191....eventually a very nice man from Egypt sent me an email with the text of the letter (the letter itself arrived a week later!

 

Her's what the letter said:

 

 

Dear Mr.S*,

 

 

 

Thank you for writing to Vodafone.

 

 

 

This is in response to the letter you have sent us regarding handset issues.

 

 

 

I understand how frustrating this could have been for you and apologise if there has been any miscommunication from our end.

 

 

 

I assure you that we take customer complaint very seriously and we ensure proper feedback is given as and when required.

 

 

 

In order to resolve any customer issues we follow an internal escalation procedure. Whenever customers contact us with any issue related to their Vodafone account, we try to resolve the issue first. We only escalate an issue in case it is not resolved. I have already discussed the issue with my manager.

 

 

 

I am sorry about the trouble you faced with the handset. Vodafone does offer a variety of handsets however holds no responsibility for the phones performance. We are only able to help customers get the device repaired.

 

 

 

Vodafone will only repair agreement handsets that are under warranty and were purchased directly via a Vodafone channel. Out of warranty handsets may be repaired but will incur a charge.

 

 

 

If the phone has suffered physical or liquid damage, the warranty will not cover this. A charge might get applied for an out of warranty repair/replacement. I am afraid we are not able to override the decision taken by the repairs team.

 

 

 

They have agreed to offer you a replacement handset in exchange at a one off cost of £325.00. As a gesture of goodwill, we can credit your Vodafone account with £100.00. Please revert with a confirmation if you agree to this offer and we will apply the credit and place an order for a replacement handset at the earliest.

 

 

 

As our valued customer, we request you to co-operate and give us another chance to raise our bar to serve you.

 

 

 

I trust this helps.

 

 

 

Regards

 

Nathan (Surname removed for security)

 

Vodafone Customer Services

 

 

This was clearly boilerplate. Interesting to see that the cost had gone up by £25. Thats inflation for you . So i replied to the email address asking for contact details for Mr D, saying:

 

Dear Ahmed,

 

Many thanks for forwarding this to me. The printed letter has yet to arrive.

 

I also notice that Mr D has not included any contact details.

 

 

 

I would be most grateful if you would therefore forward this email to Mr D.

 

 

 

Dear Mr D

 

 

 

Thank you for your brief letter in response to my detailed complaint. I note that your response falls outside the target you set for dealing with complaints, which of course adds to my concerns about the way this has been dealt with by Vodafone.

 

 

 

I was a little shocked by the content. It is clear that you have used a template and provided standard answers, and have either not read my letter or are choosing to ignore it.

 

 

 

To simply re-iterate what I had been told in the shop and on 191 is simply not good enough. Please deal with the issues I raise; in particular I maintain that the phone was under warranty, that physical damage was not, according to the apple store, involved. Even the most cursory inspection of the phone itself indicates that it is in perfect condition and unmarked. Under tha sale of goods act Vodafone is responsible for correcting the faults which occurred within the warranty period.

 

 

 

Your offer of a replacement handset risks being derisory; Three minutes search indicates that I can purchase a new, sim free unlocked iphone 4s from a reputable shop for £199.

 

 

 

You also failed to address the customer service issues I raised.

 

 

 

I am surprised that, in the copy of the letter (which has yet to arrive physically) you do not indicate the options open to me should I not be satisfied with your response. Would I be right in thinking that this should now go to OFCOM?

 

 

 

I await your speedy response with mounting impatience. May I remind you that my daughter’s phone has now not been usable since April?

 

Cordially (signature)

 

I also sent it to the website for complaints, which indicated a reply within 48 hours. 52 hours later, a phone call from someone who had skimmed the letter. It was a long and frustrating call, I'm sure for him as well as me. Substance was he believed what the services folks said without question, so that was it. He also said that what the apple store folks told me must be untrue. However, vodafone aprarently cant communicate with apple.

 

 

Also nothing he could do about the second part of my complaint (regarding the terrible service) other than "provide internal feedback. Ha!

 

So phone out of action for coming up to 6 months, failures all round in communications from vodafone. And I'm again waiting. I said i wanted to take it to the next stage, at which i was told he would get back to me. Nothing so far.

 

Fact of the matter is that this has been a horrendous waste of my time with probably the most unresponsive customer service/complaints system I have experienced. A couple of false starts where it seems that someone in the organisation is going to take ownership, but then.....pfft.

 

Does anyone have any suggestions?

Paul

41 REPLIES 41

Someone got back to me a few minutes ago. I was assured that vodafone only provide original apple new phones. I wonder why I'm finding that hard to believe? Now waiting for a further callback.

Ah, but as vodafone customer services said to me... "Most people wouldnt have persisted in the way you have". One view is that this is part of their business model. Water damage and mechanical damage void warranties, so label it that way! The fact that apple said the mess inside my phone was obvious also says that the tech team are either incompetent or something worse. In my case, I now have a report from apple both before and after vodafone engineers looked at the phone, which means that they cant argue that somehow I had the phone tricked up after sending it to them! good luck with small claims. I'm going through Trading standards as I was clearly provided with a phone which was neither new nor apple reconditioned, which seems to my uneducated mind fraudulent.

Update David (Removed by moderator) called back. To cut a long story short, he offered an early release from contract (actually a few months!) so we could upgrade. I rejected this pointing out that under Sale of goods they were oibliged to replace the handset. Offfer 2: send the handset back and we will repair it for you. Astonishing. Much discussion....clearly indicatd that as far as they were concerned there was "no evidence" that the phone was rconditioned. Eh? So I should send the phone back and they would then decide what to offer. Now this means sending the phone back to the people who had prevously said that it was "Mechanical damege". Do I trust them? not one bit. Plus Trading standards had suggested that i should hold on to it until they had processed what I had sent to them. So he said no phone return, no resolution. Then it emerges that he is also dealing with the email I sent to the cheif exec. So....all this publicity about how the cheif exec of vodafone pays attention to this is so much waffle. More that that, given that I wrrote to the chief exec in part to complain about customer relations and their not being in any way acessible, this means that Customer Relations are dealing with complaints about themselves. I indicated towards the end of the conversatin that I did not regard myself as having been offered a resolution. Got pressure then from David (Removed by moderator)...."in that case I wont send you the returns bag". I had clearly stated that when Trading standards had dealt with this I would gladly sent it. It is, after all, just so much junk. So, can Vodafone be trusted? Paul

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? So I wrote to the vodafone CEO office because customer relations were being uncontacable and generally useless. Guess who is investigating customer relations on behalf of the CEO? Customer relations. What chance to I have of getting vodafone to behave reasonably? Place your bets please.... Paul

Phil
Community Manager (Retired)
Community Manager (Retired)

paintpop, 

 

I appreciate your frustration with this, however if a phone has been damaged, there will be a charge for any repair of the device.  You can always send it direct to Apple to give you a second opinion on the cost if you prefer.  

 

PaulSalk, 

 

We're unable to intervene in any Customer Relations cases.  As they're currently looking into your issue we'll leave you in their hands.  Let us know if you have any different issues you'd like our help with though. 

 

Thanks, 

 

Phil

Dear Administrator. If you are going to join in this conversation please say something constructive, or at least something knowledgable and not a 'Vodafone political statement'. My phone was NOT damaged. It stopped working because of a VERY common design fault by Apple. Apple refuse to recognise this, but thousands of customers have the same problem. Don't want to believe me. go onto Google(or any search engine) and type 'Iphone 4S power button stuck'. At the end of today, when you finally get through the thousands of posts about this, you will realise that I didnt damage my phone, it had a design fault. While your company absolutely knows this, you continue to remove money from my bank account for a phone that doesnt work. I, did not get my phone from Apple. I could have but I didn't. I got it from the company that I have been a loyal customer to for many many years. Your response is to treat me like I'm trying to steal soemthing from your shop. You do not have customer Service. Perhaps you should change it to Customer Swervice.   I believe this is going to come back and bite your company soon so why don't you, have a word with the person who tells you what to say and do and let them know that your customers are VERY UNHAPPY.

Thanks Phil. Its not damaged, it was a badly reconditioned phone. I'm not suggesting you intervene, I am simply pointing out what is happening to me as a vodafone customer and what I view to be the inappropriate behaviour of Customer Relations, their inacessibility and so on. . Given that the phone vodafone provided me appears to be a fake and the fact that vodafone techs did not spot what apple spotted in an instance i think others who might be in the same position have a right to know. There is no way the phone should be reparied....apple said it was a badly reconditioned phone full of third party components. Vodafone, with a second apple report, now appear to be acccepting this after six unpleasant months of tryng to get an acknowledgement.l This forum provides feedbac to you and other customers.

Update:

There were more no-results calls to and fro. Which Computing have taken the case up. With prompting from them, I spoke with a very sulky Customer Relations person who i had been asked to call.  Turned out that he didnt have what he needed so i had to call back next day. I was offered a repair; when i pointed out that it was a fake phone in the first place i was offered a "nearly new" one. Pointed out that replacing a fake phone with a reconditioned one was not appropriate under sale of goods legislation. I indicated that i thought it was time to go to ombudsman; he said not, it was not unresolved (eh??) He said someone more senior would call me back next day. That was two weeks ago.  They didnt. I contacted the which folk early last week, who contacted vodafone and were told that someone would get in touch without fail and then keep an eye on the situation. guess what? no call, no contact.

 

So, to summarise, I was sold a phone which was a fake by vodafone. Apple refused to deal with it under the warranty (because it was a fake) and vodafone repair failed to notice this, indicating instead "mechanical damage". After about eight hours to and fro, including being told that  complaints had to be in writing in a letter, told to take it back to apple. they give me printed reports.....its a fake. Vodafone say no way, we only provide genuine apple products. maybe i should take it up with apple. I take it up with vodafone ceo office, they become unreachable. Which take it up as a case, profess themselves a bit gobsmacked.

 

So here I am still. Phone sitting on my desk, a fake. Vodafone promising to deal with it, but not. Nine months gone by. i have spent I estimate 11 hours on this. Vodafone seem unconcerned that somehow a fake got into their supply chain. I'm pretty sure that this is a fraudulent, not clear who is the perpetrator though.

 

Can anyone believe that it has taken so long, and that vodafone's customer relations and customer services are so amazingly impossible? I wonder if this is in fact their business model. I will leave as soon as contracts expire.

 

Reading between the lines it appears Vodafone have accidently sent you a reconditioned handset :smileyhappy:

Given the lack of technical knowledge from the registered repair company they have probably made a terminator iPhone from spare parts deeming it reconditioned.

Voda should take the Apple comments as validation to the claim & provide a replacement device that is fit for intended purpose.

 

Hoping for a positive outcome for you.

~~Clear eyes - Full Hart - Can't lose~~
“As wars come and go, my soldier stays eternal”

My comments represent my opinion which is not affiliated or sponsored in any way. 

Thanks, sounds like you are right. What is intriguing is their reaction, which is flat denial in the face of clear evidence, and the way that they repeatedly failed to follow up, to the point of making it actually impossible to speak to "customer relations" (sic). How can something like this still be unresolved after nine months and the multiple steps I have gone through? It suggests to me either (1) customer relations and customer services are not fit for purpose or (2) this is their business model, i.e. stonewall until the complaint "goes away".