Vodafone Hub with ethernet switches

[JonScholefield]

I have a relatively complex home network: the Vodafone hub connects to a NetGear FS108 Fast Ethernet Switch; that switch then connects to various ethernet sockets around my house with devices connected

In two of those sockets I have identical TP-Link TL-SF1005D switches, which connect to a small number of additional devices.

All of this worked absolutely fine for years with my BT HomeHub AND worked absolutely fine with my Vodafone hub for about a month.

But, suddenly, it seems that anything connected via one of the TP-Link switches is getting incredibly slow ping speeds (>5 SECONDS, not miliseconds). I have no idea what has changed. 

My internet speed is excellent and I've tried disconnecting everything and re-connecting, factory resets etc. 

As far as I can make out, the problem seems to be that devices connected to the Vodafone hub via two switches are now getting a very low bandwidth - but it all worked fine with the same Vodafone hub for several weeks and indeed with the previous BT HomeHub for years... 

HUGE KUDOS to any networking genius out there who can help diagnose and resolve the problem!!! I'm not a technical expert (nor a technical noob) - but I am at a loss!!

[Anonymous]

First thing to check is that if you've any cables that just had one end plugged in, no one has plugged the other end in to "just to make it look neater".  

I guess the other thing I'd be thinking about is the age of the switches - they don't last forever, that Netgear switch could be pretty ancient, and probably be looking to upgrade to 10/100/1000 versions anyhow.

[JonScholefield]

Thanks for taking the time with these suggestions. Sadly, nothing so straightforward, but I continue to investigate. 

[xdmn_083]

Personally I think I would be looking at whether the cabling between switch and router is OK, including loose/broken clips and considering the possibility that there's a cable-end that's been bent just once too often. These don't have to be a problem, e.g. right now I have two extra-long cables with broken clips that I tied onto their switches with freezer bag ties several years ago and are still fine

I've had cases on various networks where the pings seemed fine but with a complete failure to be able to get any data along the wire, and it turned out to be a duff connector or a bit of wire that was on its last strand.

I take it the devices sharing a switch have no problem talking to each other? And because I believe in the scattergun approach, have you checked there's no conflicting DHCP service appeared unexpectedly? Also, escaped hamsters etc.

[JonScholefield]

Thanks for these suggestions. Having done more investigation, it seems that the issue is caused by an old Humax box which is connected by ethernet for on demand TV in a spare room... although it is in standby mode, when it's connected to the network everything seems to break. Bizarre! 

HOPEFULLY, that has resolved the problem (unplug the troublemaker), but is there any way I could have found this without trial and error? E.g. I tried Wireshark but it's way too technical for me. 

Is there a "simple" app out there which can map out a moderately complex home network and analyse where problems might be?

[Anonymous]

If there is nothing on the Humax box that you desperately need to keep you might try resetting it (IPTV again!).

As to an app that might help you identify issues on your net, all the major router manufacturers have their own apps, or you could try something like "Fing".

[JonScholefield]

Fing looks like a great tip - huge thanks! The Vodafone Hub seems to have very little useful diagnostic utility, although doesn't seem like a bad unit overall...?

That said, Vodafone's helpdesk, whilst polite and more helpful than your average dispersed call centre folk, seem to be totally untrained to support the router itself: fair enough for the front-line, but you can't actually speak to technical support directly and no chance of having a conversation about the utility functions, nor any kind of manual... seems like a shame to design something and then be unable to support it!

Last question: what is the group consensus on whether it's worth replacing the Vodafone Hub with a mesh router and satellites? Strikes me that the advantage would be a single wifi network for a large property, but maybe not as good as it sounds when we also have ethernet and perhaps just creating a different set of problems?

[Anonymous]

If you swap to using anything third party, then Vodafone support cannot help you at all.  So you need to keep the old router out of the way somewhere so that you can plug it in again if things go wrong!

As for using a Mesh system, the whole idea is that it should be totally transparent, you should be able to set it up and forget that it's there - which is not quite the same as using conventional extenders.  If you are the one getting nagged when the home network goes down, then I would genuinely recommend a Mesh system!

*Personally using an Asus RT-AC86U as router, with a meshed satellite RT-AC68U (2012 V0.98a version) the two connected using powerline adapters (TP-Link) - it's a little clunkier for old devices than a designed for Mesh system, but it works and is transparent to users.

[Gazza_B]

I see that you have “fixed” your problem by disconnecting a Humax Device from your network,

Just a bit of general advice, daisy chaining network devices can be a problem as budget switches have a limited amount of resources. Switches ( as opposed to hubs) “ Learn” the MAC address of the device connected to each port, and then ‘ switch’ the data from one port to another based on where the data is going to and from.

if you add another switch downstream then there are multiple devices connected to each port of the upstream switch...

Sometimes a simple turn it off and on again will ‘cure’, a switch that has run out of memory albeit temporarily.

[JonScholefield]

Thanks again for the comments. 

I thought I'd nailed it, but today (with zero having changed since yesterday) both WiFi extenders were dropping out intermittently. I resolved the problem by the good old turn them off and back on again, and I rebooted the Vodafone Hub for good measure.

It's all working again perfectly now, but it always puzzles me why resets like this are necessary: I assume ip addresses are timing out somehow (and at one point with my previous router I took the time to set up every device in my household with a static IP address, which seemed to help). But it remains frustrating that network gear can't figure out that there's a problem for itself and resolve it without needing to be reset... 

I'm going to see how stable things are for the next week or so and may upgrade to a mesh system because the time spent rebooting everything probably makes it worth the cost.