Fraud, Final nail in the coffin. Years of issues.

[Manchester31]

Hello everyone, Firstly I would like to apologise if this topic isn’t in the correct area but I cannot actually find where to post it specifically for fraud and the trouble I’ve had, I know this a long post but it highlights some of the things happening. I have had a year of hell with Vodafone and as the title suggests, I’ve finally had enough. I’ll get on to everything else that has happened further on but for this part would like to explain the current issue. Before Christmas I received a letter thanking me for setting up a direct debit, this was for an account I didn’t recognise at all.

Now I apparently have a complex account…. Basically I have two, separate lines and each has their own direct debit details. Both numbers are on the same account and in my name. Now this letter that arrived from Vodafone was in my name and my other half’s direct debit details. There is only one company in the world that has this configuration so clearly I knew the letter was genuine. I phoned up on the 22nd of December immediately, the guy I spoke to couldn’t find this account on the system and stated to ignore it. I was insistent that this wasn’t correct and something wasn’t right, seeing as the details of the direct debit matched one of the lines in my name. Eventually the guy listened to me and spoke to the fraud team. He then came back on and informed me that there was a fraud, someone had opened up an account using them details on the 25th November. He stated that the reason he couldn’t find the account was because it had been opened up on their old system.

After discussing this he informed me that Vodafone don’t even use the old system no more when new accounts are created and in actual fact all existing customers had been being moved across for sometime. Only Vodafone staff have access to this system too! He then told me not to worry the account had been closed and suggested I get my partner to check their bank for direct debits. After the call they did and low and behold there was a new direct debit, however I then realised this was in my name so went to check my credit score. Low and behold on the 25th of November there’s been a massive hit to my score with negative markers also a deduction of 70 points. This hit on my score from Vodafone shows my name as Vodafone have it. Not the correct spelling. On my Vodafone account someone has put two letters the wrong way when I initially took out the account. Probably spell check on there end. Not only that but the 2nd line which I have with Vodafone, I have only had it 4 years (the one I’ve had nothing but trouble with for the past year) I’d only recently upgraded this. The other line had been five years. Well the marker shows the search on my credit file with the length of time at my address as 4 years. I’ve actually lived here nearly a decade so that number clearly has come from the length of time that line has been active! It was at this point that I realised this has got to be someone within Vodafone, like I said only they have access to the old system where this new account had been secretly stuffed.

The main call centres have informed me that only instore staff and senior within Vodafone can go on that system. Only Vodafone have my other half’s direct debit details under my misspelled name. Doesn’t take a genius to click here does it. Now I phoned back up the next day, now with the knowledge my score had also been hit. I was then told it was an internal investigation against a staff member and apologises all around. I was told a letter would be sent out and that the account was closed oh and the phones on the new line had been issued from a shop. You see it baffled me that someone had apparently managed to get phones in my name and also with direct debit details that didn’t match my name, then to the fact that Vodafone didn’t pick up on this. I then got assigned via the credit agency a support person to help deal with the fact this had happen (not through Vodafone may I add) They informed me that on the 25th November a search from Vodafone was run, then another, then another, until (in their words, it wouldn’t pass). Bit strange don’t you think? That someone would walk into a store and keep adding lines and a staff member would stand there and not question this? Nevertheless Vodafone admitted it was internal. The fraud support worker has told me Vodafone now have to remove this information as they cannot. Now I have been checking my credit file to make sure this is corrected and still nothing has changed so I decided to phone Vodafone on Friday and guess what, apparently they haven’t got a clue what I’m talking about. I read the letter I received over Christmas from Vodafone, the one from their fraud team apologising and promising to rectify this but apparently there’s been no such account. The 1st guy I spoke to read through my notes about what had happened yet couldn’t find the account, I explained that I’d been told it had been set up on their old systems etc. He then spoke to the fraud team.

They claim to not have any fraudulent investigation, they also stated to him that the account belonged to a woman even though he couldn’t find it. He came back on the line and said he didn’t understand what the hell was going on because it was obvious this was real, my notes stated so as well as the letters I had etc. He then transferred me through to the fraud team but it wasn’t them, it was their normal switchboard and I had to start again. This went on with every single person I spoke to over a 4 hour period! I’d explain then they’d just transfer me and I’d be back to square one. I eventually spoke to a guy who couldn’t be bothered helping but he promised to transfer me to the fraud team. A woman answered and I clearly annoyed at this point, she then asked which account it was I wanted to report for fraud. Was it the line I was on or the one of my partner, I explained repeatedly that it was nothing to do with the account I was on and someone had used my details to open another line but she refused to help unless it was the line I was on. I demanded to speak to a manager and she put me on hold only to return and tell me the manager refused. She then said “in order to get through to the fraud team I’d have to report it first” this was when I lost it, she wasn’t the fraud team, she was billing and the guy I’d spoken to had put me back to billing after stating it was the fraud team! I explained it was an ongoing fraud investigation for a separate line and I wasn’t reporting a new one! But again getting nowhere at all. I gave her the ref and the account number for the account, which low and behold she couldn’t find. I then asked for the fraud teams number and she wouldn’t give me it.

After a further half hour she actually gave me the number, first wrong only 7 digits but then the actual number (or so I’m lead to believe, haven’t had a chance to phone it yet as they’re closed until Monday) The number is apparently 07770999999. Vodafone are stating on other calls this account doesn’t exist. I was given the reference for the account when I originally phoned on the 22nd and that ref was on a new direct debit set up! It’s like they’re trying to cover it up! Now my credit score has this marker, I’m getting nowhere at all with phoning, I’m really at the end of it now. I have had nothing but trouble with Vodafone! In late 2015 I was constantly having crossed connections, I’d be on the phone and end up on someone else’s conversation. My phone would also ring and say “unknown number” I’d answer and would be in the middle of someone else’s call! Any calls I made were cut off halfway through or even instantly and for months I couldn’t use my phone at home however my partner’s line was fine.

They eventually sorted this out then in May I received a phone call from the upgrade team and was told I was eligible for early upgrade, I didn’t want to upgrade as I’d actually been thinking of leaving because of constantly loosing signal and issues with calls cutting off or cross connections for months prior. That call ended with me stating this. Ten minutes later I received a text informing me that my passwords had been changed?!? I couldn’t log in, four calls later whoever I’d spoken to had took it upon themselves to merge my lines, delete the logins and merge the direct debits. From that point on I no longer had separate login details. Then randomly I’d receive texts informing me that my passwords had been changed or username. That continues to happen, I’d then decided I was definitely leaving when my contract was up for that line in September. I was going to keep my old phone and go with sim only from somewhere else.

My phone decided to die a few weeks before this however, being insured I went to the store and was met with an idiot of an agent. He wouldn’t accept the phone was covered under extended warrantee on power failure (as all pay monthly accounts have extended warrantee for this) So I told him to send it off under my insurance. He then informed me that there were no courtesy phones, I wasn’t bothered about a courtesy phone. He was trying to talk me out of getting my phone fixed? For love nor money I couldn’t understand what his game was. Then he suggested I BUY a new phone to tie me over while the others off for repair. I just wanted my phone fixed! He then informed me that I could upgrade, I didn’t have any interest in doing it. After this weird ballroom dance he finally took my phone. I eventually after weeks get my phone back, they’re saying now that the camera was broken (I took it in for power failure and non-charging but what ever….).

I then decided to give my month notice. The guy I spoke to seemed nice enough and was trying to do everything to keep me. Eventually he offered me a great deal and I have to see, like a kid in sweet shop, I gave in. The deal was 30% plus waver of the delivery and handset cost. He went through the insurance details and what have you and like an idiot I agreed. Five minutes later he phoned back to tell me that unfortunately everything I’d just been told was wrong and it would require higher insurance. I told the guy to cancel it, I wasn’t being messed around. A deals a deal and I’ll happily leave! He puts me on hold and comes back with 40% off, working out at £3 cheaper with insurance than he’d quoted before. So I accept…….. Five days go by and still no phone only now it really needs to come because I’m going on holiday in another 4. I phone to enquire and I’m promised it will be here before then and it just about is.

I’m now three days into my holiday when I get a text message informing me that my bill is £198. Now this couldn’t be right as I was on the new 12gig plan with 2gig roming so I knew it wasn’t data charges. I phoned to be told that the phone that WAS COVERED under my insurance had cost £150 to fix. After arguing for half an hour the guy offered me £50 off the bill! I told him I’d be straight on the phone for legal advice once I was back in the uk. I was arguing with this man for over an hour about the fact I had been paying £73pa for insurance and why the hell would I do that if it was going to cost me £150. Oh I forgot to mention that phone could be purchased for £80 new online. I made the guy read my insurance policy and eventually, frustrated, he apologised and removed the charge.

I returned back off holiday and this is when it really starts to get tiresome. I receive my first upgraded bill. It’s double what it should be, I phone up and I’m told everything is correct. Unbeknown to me (I will call this twilight effect because my accounts were merged in such a way, whenever I phone, even though I’m on my number) Vodafone takes me onto my partners line which is all perfect, thankfully. So they’re on my line and some reason the 40% isn’t applied. It shows 40% in the app but wouldn’t you know it when I log in “unfortunately something went wrong” happens whenever I try and retrieve my bill. I’m then told I don’t have 40%, yet it’s there on the app. I insist they listen to the call where I took out the upgrade and I also point out that I have it as a text etc. Plus do they really think I’d have not been given any deal when upgrading? Low and behold it’s suddenly there.

They can see it, hallelujah, it’s a miracle….. Still, I have been charged double so what do they plan to do about it? Well they tell me it’s all sorted and my next bill will have the money owed refunded and not to worry as the 40% is there and sorted. Just now to wait until my next bill date. Along comes my next bill date, October now. The bills a completely different amount alright, still nearly double. So I phone and of course the twilight zone kicks in and I’m magically transported to nothing makes sense land. After landing back on my account we start the whole rigmarole of “you don’t have 40% oh yes you do” and I’m now informed that I’m also being charged £6.99 for my old insurance and £12 for my new. So I’m being charged full price then nearly £18 for my insurance. To sort this out takes 100s of hours and air miles visiting nothing makes sense land. Each time I’m promised it will be sorted. In order to cancel the other insurance I have to make around 15 calls, checking the app to see if it’s still there etc. Making sure when I phone that I state clearly I want the £6.99 one gone and not the £12. Oh and also to leave my partners line well alone!

During this time my partners phone starts to play up and we’re dreading the trip to nothing makes sense land. I take their phone into the store and it vanishes! Urgh, just like that. I don’t know this though. Weeks go buy and my partner receives a text on their courtesy phone stating they’ll be charged for the phone as it’s been on loan for a month. Are they kidding at this point? My partner phones up and is told the phone has been repaired and was ready to pick up 2 days ago. They go into the store to be told it hasn’t been sent to there. They’ve still got the courtesy phone, yet there’s mixed information coming from the store. One person suggest it was there and someone’s taken it. When phoning, we’re be told it couldn’t be repaired, so what the hell was going on before is anyone’s guess. It is the twilight zone after all. Now Vodafone are all apologises again and it turns out they don’t have the same model at moment that my partners repair was for.

They offer an upgrade free to the latest handset. Nice of them eh, days go by and nothing so they phone again to be told it’s at the store…. Sounds familiar? This time, no phone (nothing makes sense theme music playing) mixed information. They send another, this one is there! Finally after 5 weeks they can return the courtesy phone. Now back to my line, At this point it’s three months of the same “wait until your bill date, we promise it’s sorted” “we’ve applied the 40%” “we’ve cancelled the other insurance” It doesn’t happen. I finally spoke to a very nice woman who sorted out the billing side instantly. She removed the original deal which hadn’t been applied and put a new 40% deal on. Now I’m still yet to know properly if my bill is right because in November I didn’t actually get billed. Money that was owed created a zero bill and last months had money refunded on top so this month will actually be my first proper bill. Hopefully that will be solved but like I said before, I cannot get into my bills for my line, I can just about log in but the bills don’t work. I can only see current charges on the app. I haven’t been in to the store for months as they always tell me I have to phone up and can’t help.

All this has been beyond stressful and not that I’m using the health card but I would like to make one point clear, I’ve recently had a cardio event I’ve been quite ill. I’ve been told to avoid all stress and this company is making me seriously stressed. I cannot believe the trouble I’ve had and I know I’m not the only person either. The customer service is diabolical and now I have markers on my credit score through their incompetence yet they’re acting like nothing has happened. I try and complain and I’m told its sorted so nothing ever gets marked as a complaint or better still they cut me off or just transfer my call mid conversation. What the hell am I supposed to do? You cannot complain online it’s just a postal address. I phone and they will not put me through to the relevant people. I’ve spoken to the regulator and they said I have to have an active complaint in place for four weeks. I’m really at the end of it all now. 

[BandOfBrothers]

Hi @Manchester31

What a sequence of events you've had to which I'm not surprised your unimpressed with.  

This forum has Vodafone Teams who engage when and where they can. I'm sure they will with you if you need this assistance. 

To be caught up in fraud is bad enough but to be followed by what happens next with the phones failing to then receiving notifications of password changes to the deal being offered then retracted would test the resolve of most people and then finding out a charge has been applied without consultation for a handset repair. 

I've read before where a store rep has tried to sell a phone if a courtesy phone isn't available. I normally suggest to ask friends,family or colleagues as someone tends to have one in a drawer somewhere.

They in my knowledge should only add a charge for repair if the account holder authorises this. So the account holder can give their acceptance or ask for it back untouched and then approach the manufacturers or push for a repair from the network.

The Communications Omsbudsman deal with issues thst reach their level. Vodafone are permitted 8 weeks to resolve raised problems. The 8 weeks can be circumvented if Vodafone agree to a Deadlock letter.  Link to Vodafone Code of Practice.

I really do wish you well and a speeds amicable resolution to all of this. 

[Manchester31]

  Hello, Thank you for the reply. It’s been an absolute nightmare. It’s the gift that keeps on giving. I’ve been trying to access my account details in order to write to the CEO but what do you know, I can once again no longer log in. I can only view summaries now on my phone. I was on my account in December when the latest trouble started, confirming the account for the letter wasn’t mine. Now I cannot get on again. Their website tells me my pin and memorable word is incorrect, then it tells me my email isn’t registered, I try and reregister and it’s telling me the email is already registered. I try and reset and it send me a code to then be told the code isn’t valid. I’ve had it now, I really have. I don’t understand why now since I phoned on Friday, my app is asking for pins and usernames even though its showing my account summery via 4g. I had a pin number set up which has been the only way I can log in. I’m furious, I really am. I wasn’t bothered about needing a courtesy phone it was the whole palaver with the guy in the store. It took forever when he was sat down to process the insurance. He kept staring out of the shop window and asking the same questions. It was weird, it was like the little Britain sketch of “computer says no”. He asked me to repeat my name and number several times yet never typed a single thing then stared out of the window. I’m sick to the teeth though I really am. This now with their fraud is beyond a joke. Their own staff have brought this upon me and its affected my credit file and will further down the line cause issues with credit.

[BandOfBrothers]

You're more than welcome for my reply. 

Unfortunately every business has employees that perhaps are not as committed as they should be no matter how much in house training is given. That's putting it politely.

Thst said they are in place to help and support. I'm pretty laid back but if this was me sitting there I'd have been thinking of asking for a senior member of staff for help. 

Things can sometimes go wrong which I'm sure many accept, but then it's ultimately down to how it's put right that then counts ,and instills confidence back into the product and service.

Communication is Key.

Regarding your Credit File. 

This help thread I wrote may help which touches upon the Vodafone department that deals with credit files called the Credit File Support Team and about adding a Notice of Correction. 

Link > Default-on-your-Credit-File-and How-to-add-a-Notice-of-Correction.

[Manchester31]

I’ve asked until I’m blue in the face to speak to someone higher up and it’s the same story each and every single time, They say they’re either putting me on hold and the line goes dead or they transfer me to the main 191 switchboard. This isn’t a credit agreement on my file this is a series of searches showing the negative effect. Credit expert have already put a notice on it and have said up-to now Vodafone has failed to respond to their initial request. The fraud advisor said because they repeatedly hit my file that’s why it’s now showing a negative marker. It’s not a missed payment or default. It’s on the searches. I wasn’t even aware searches can do this. I’ve spent years building my score. It was 940 in October and now it’s 870. The fact is Vodafone are telling me they haven’t got a clue to the fraud and it’s never happened. I’m waiting now for the inevitable, I will probably receive a letter stating money owed such is the incompetence of this company. I haven’t had a single good experience. I’ll be honest with you, I was wary of leaving them when I was going to initially. The stories I’ve read and heard. I’ve just phoned the 191 number and my pin works fine on that so I cannot understand what they have done to my account. It worked fine before I phoned on Friday via the app. Now it’s asking for log in details whereas before I just entered my pin. I’m going to make as many copies of this letter as I can from the fraud team, that way if they dare suggest I owe anything I have the documentation. I think now maybe the only option is to speak to the press, they’ve had a bumper year last year with bad press and I’m sure this level of incompetence would be jumped at by a national paper. I don’t think I can face another call, I’m going to have to ring now because their system is not allowing me in and stating my account doesn’t exist. Both myself and my partner have to use the same log in, this isn’t just affecting me but them. They’ve had charges and we can’t even see what they’re for. I’ll phone up, they’ll send a text to change the password etc it won’t work, as always, then I’m locked out.

[BandOfBrothers]

When people discuss applying for a contract etc and are declined it's strongly advised not to re apply for 90 days to allow the credit File / score to recover so Yes multiple searches together can be detrimental. 

As I mentioned earlier the Team here maybe able to help and guide you. They read all posts so it msy take a short while for them to catch up with your post. 

[Manchester31]

Well I’m on the phone now to Vodafone they’re completely fobbing me off. You’re not going to believe this. They have said no fraud has taken place in their investigate, they said it was an old account.

Number one: I never had another account.

Number two: A direct debit with the reference stated on the letter that alerted me that an account was opened on my partners account in Dec, was the same as the new one on their bank account the bank confirmed this ref number and date.

Number three: My credit score states Vodafone searched repeatedly 25th Nov.

Number four: I have a letter here stating the fraud was found and identified. So how does an apparently old account set up a new direct debit then run repeated searches in my name and to boot all my accounts passwords and login details were changed last week. I’m disgusted they’re covering this up. I’m Getting in touch with the regulator. Im astonished in fact.

I'm doing everything i can now to leave this company. I know they cannot be heald responsible for their staff but to do this is beyond a joke. The woman i spoke to said. "if its only happened last month it wouldn't even affect your score that quick" It's on there with a big red triangle saying it has. She also said "I can speak to the credit file team, they can usually sort out old searches" so i pointed out two months ago isn't an old seach and how does an old, static account preform a search.

[Manchester31]

Quick update, I finally got a call back off the women I spoke to this morning. She was adamant no fraud had taken place. She then offered to put me through to the credit file team. She put me on hold and came back on to say the lady she was about to transfer me to was also in agreement no fraud had taken place. The women from the credit file team started the conversation with the line “Hi Mr ***********, rest assured there is no problem with your account and no fraud has taken place” I then explained a few times and finally when she wouldn’t accept what I was saying, I read the letters. At this point her stance changed and she asked to confirm the account number. I did so, she then said she had been given a completely different account. She couldn’t find the one I’d given her, I explained again that it had apparently been set up on their old system.

This time she found everything. The fraud was there and it is being treated as an internal. She said it had been stopped and my credit file had been wiped for this. Obviously this hasn’t happened. She then said to wait 30 days for it to update etc. Then she was very apologetic and said she was shocked by what has happened and could sympathise. Anyways I spoke to the fraud support worker via the credit agency again. He said it would instantly update due to the type of marker but he’s monitoring it currently. Thank god I’ve got paperwork. Thanks again for your help.

[hrym]

When you speak to the team, it might be worth asking if it's possible that your account has been migrated from the old system to the new and that the old details have somehow re-activated.   If I've read this correctly (forgive me, there's a lot of it), what you need is for the old system account to be closed (which should also cancel the dd), overpayments to be refunded and your credit file cleaned up.   I'd throw a chunk of compensation into the mix as well if it is definitely a VF fault (and, from what you say, I can't see that it isn't).

I suspect this is a rare (maybe even unique) situation, but I've seen old data develop a new life elsewhere and it may be related to database rollbacks or system restores.

[Manchester31]

This is a brand new account that has been created on their old system with new direct debits and searches, not an existing one. They've already told me they have had an internal investigation and the phones had been sent to and collected from a store. They also checked the cctv which has confirmed the member of staff responsible.

They're unable to tell me which store for privacy reasons. I've spoken again to them and they have confirmed three lines were applied for on this new account, one after the other and taken out on the 25th November. They're saying that the member of staff is in the process of being prosecuted. I already had this confirmed via letters stating those responsible would be prosecuted but it was the fact that each and every time I phoned their call centre staff wouldn’t help and kept searching only on the new system and I have since found out that they had recorded the wrong account number.

When I phoned on Friday the woman I spoke to searched the new system, even though I made it clear it was not a new fraud and was on their old system. Then because it wasn’t there, which it wouldn’t be as fraud team had instantly closed it on the 22nd December and it was on the old system. She then marked the fraud as completed and closed the new case which she had just created during that call for the account number in question. That was because the account didn’t exist no more and was only viewable to the fraud team on the old system.

So from that point that reference was showing her results from Friday, meaning to any other staff member it looked like it was completed but it was the searched results created on the wrong system by the lady on Friday that were now showing as clear. As I have explained before, only Vodafone have the direct debit details of my partner, under my misspelled name. Never the less when I spoke to their fraud team they were able to access the other account and confirm this fraud as well as the letters I have in relation to the investigation.

The fact that no one would transfer my call and refused to listen is what’s made this even more stressful. They have then recorded a wrong account number so when I did speak to the fraud team they had no fraud showing initially. The minute I gave them the number again they confirmed it also stating that the previous staff member gave them a completely different number. This is what is ridiculous, I give a number and they mark a completely different one! It’s once again, complete incompetence!

As I have said above I have had a year of hell with them. You tell them the sky is blue and they tell you your badgers just danced in a conga line with Elvis.

The fraud support specialist I’ve been assigned via the credit agency has confirmed that repeatedly, on the 25th of November, Vodafone LTD did what was known as a hard search. He has confirmed applications for credit to the value of just under £1700 were processed with each search, resulting in nearly £5000 worth of credit being taken out in total against my name. It was at that point that he assumes they were knocked back for more. The system used is only accessible to Vodafone staff and these were "new application" searches.

Now because I already have two lines with Vodafone no new credit agreement would appear on my score the account would merge with my existing log. It’s just the searches and then the refusal that has had a massive negative effect. I’ve gone from excellent to 4 points less than good.

I emailed the CEO last night and had a response this morning. It's now being investigated, not just the fraud but the continual incompetence and treatment. So I’ll wait and see where this goes. I’m going to ask for a release from the contract and my partner can take over their line if they wish but I’ve had enough. My partner’s line is up in 6 months anyways.