Android OS scary app

[dazm33]

Hi there,I was checking something the other day and stumbled upon something that gave me some concern, In Kit Kat 4.4.4 and maybe other Android OS there is google play services app, This app as you will know is within the OS and to delete it would render most of your device dead, Going through permissions is a new addition and it says "NEW : directly call phone numbers, it then says "allows the app to call phone numbers without your intervention this may result in unexpected charges or calls" Now you dont have to be a rocket scientist to work out that your handset is not under your control, It also says "this app can take photos and video including using the microphone without your knowledge" There were others but would take e ages to list now what do people think of this? I have already contacted Vodafone, Tesco Mobile and Mobile Choice about this issue and all have returned the feedback as "shocking" I have since contacted Google but as yet have not responded, If your still unshure please go into settings on your android device including tablets and have a look, Thanks for reading and BYE to android so far as im concerned

[jeffkinn]

Google Play Services isn't just an app - it is now an essential part of the Android Eco System and means that the operating system can be updated in individual components rather than just one single big update. As such it marks a significant improvement in how Android will evolve and was announced in detail at Google I/O last year.

Android already knows everything about your phone and can already make a phone call - there is nothing new here, no conspiracy and nothing to worry about.

Other members of the community may well be along to give a more technical answer but it'll be the same message.

[Nabs]

I'm not entirely sure what the concern is over this core part of the Google services infrastructure.

Personally I can't see anything wrong with one part of the core OS being update to require permissions that the other will likely already have.

To think that you don't have control over your device i believe is wrong. For example it wouldn't be in Google's interest to run up your phone bill or have some badly taken images  for the user, why would they possibly need it!

In fact i think it's good that Google have been so transparent with the security model in Android, you're welcome to jump ship to another OS but neither Windows nor iOS will be anywhere near as open about what apps can and can't do on your phone.

If you are seriously concerned then best thing would be to root your phone and install the App Ops application to control the permissions each app has, be warned that this is highly likely to break things! Even better step back to a basic feature phone, since they don't run apps there is no issues of permissions to worry about, any apps typically (if i recall corectly) run in java which is entirely sandboxed so no security issues at all.

It's worth asking, which version of Play services are you using? The versions don't correspond with the OS version. I'm currently using 5.0.89 on Android 4.4.2

Do you mind posting more information about the feedback you have had from the network? It would be interesting to know what they make of this.

[dazm33]

When I gave Vodafone a call they were like you sort of not interested or maybe thinking im just another paranoid customer but then it hit the advisor and all the staff and the feedack was that they found it "scary" and will be asking questions, I was also told to come here, Tesco Mobile also thanked me for raising this issue and were looking into it, The devices I tested was LG G2, Moto E and Nexus 7 tablet, I had already said the app was part of the OS, I also fully understand that people may have bought a very costly contract or even pay and go phone and will rubbish my claims, These are understandable but the facts are looking in your face this app can ring out and how or who to is something that is very concerning more so if your on a contract, Why would I buy a feature phone when I can go with windows phone or iOS which is proven safe even the Blackberry is safe although doomed, Myself until Google releases a statement or end the "new" permission im staying well clear of Android 

[jeffkinn]

You will make whatever decision you feel is right for you. But with all due respect to the people you spoke to, they probably had no idea what they were looking at. Networks have no involvement in Android or how it works. They do have an involvement in making sure that each handset's radio software works with their network but that's it.

If you want to know more the best place is to post a question on specialist Android forums like XDA or Android Central. There are lots of people there that do know what they're talking about. 

It would be a shame to take a backwards step by moving to an inferior OS over a misplaced concern.

[Nabs]

Fair enough, everyone is entitled to an opinion and I will of course respect your concerns. I have already outlined my point of view but would be very interesting in your reasoning behind Windows and iOS being "proven safe"?
To me both of these are fully closed source Operating Systems which could be doing absolutely anything in the backgroun without your knowledge, that makes me trust them even less to be honest.
I may be mistaken but is BB10 not also closed source meaning the same issues as WP and iOS?

[thesoupdragon]

To give you a real world example of why you shouldn't worry about these permissions:

I play a Racing Game called Real Racing 3. In the last year Google introduced a process whereby you can interact with fellow game players and share scores, progression, screenshots and in some cases play against people in real time.

This ability needs to allow System level permissions. To see which of my friends play the same game as me the System will need access to the Phone app in order to read my contacts. This is not about making Phone calls without my knowledge!

If I take a screenshot of my game, I can share that to Social media sites. This will use the Messaging permissions but again does not mean the Phone is sending texts messages without my knowledge...

Historically the description of App permissions is woefully simplistic to the point where it becomes pointless; But it does satisfy a legal requirement to be transparent.

I think your concern stems from a lack of understanding of how the Android System actually works and how different levels of system processes are called upon and interact with each other.

There are some great video's on Youtube that explain much better than I can with diagrams and animated sequences to demonstrate the Operating System at work.

The Phone has no intelligence of it's own, so it can't decide to Phone or message someone without your knowledge. 

The operator (you) does not have Administrator priviledge on Android, that is what Rooting the Phone allows. It also means that things like Viruses can have little to no effect because the core functions cannot be accessed.

You are right to be vigilant with permissions but there is absolutely nothing to worry about here 

[dazm33]

Thanks for all your comments Ok clear your mind .....cleared? now forget that amazing G3 or whatever handset you have just for a moment....done? lastly forget the amount your paying which is very important...right if all is done answer this very simple question " why would a "new" permission say "this app can call numbers and may mean you will have a bigger bill at the end of the month?" Ok now ask yourself why would they say this? remembering its a "new" permission? This is all im getting at, As an eexample would you ignore a warning sign on a motorway? of course you wouldnt its the same with this but in a more subtle way

[thesoupdragon]

Google Play Services cannot dial a number on it's own from your Phone...!

As I said, these Permissions are extremely vague and usually refer to the main Function being called but in reality only needs access to a small minor process to do what it needs.

[dazm33]

Good answer its vague and I have asked Google for clarification on that troublesome permission