Vodafone not interested in helping customers using landline phone sockets mandatory move to VoIP

[ojos]

I am a Vodafone broadband customer which includes a landline phone service. I have had landline service for many years originally provided by BT. This includes a incoming Master Socket with cabling extending from it all around my property. This interior cabling connects numerous individual traditional phone sockets all around. When I moved over to Vodafone broadband a couple of years ago, they arranged for Openreach to fit a new Master Socket suitable for the new router. Openreach told me the new Master Socket would be compatible with full fibre when that became available in my area. At the same time Openreach checked and renewed all my interior landline phone cabling to ensure that all the existing phone sockets connected to the new Master Socket.

The Vodafone router supplied to me then was model THG3000. Vodafone have now informed me that in the next couple of years or so all landline phone service will be connected through VoIP via a new type of router and that my current router does not support this.  I asked what about all my current interior cable connected phone sockets which are crucial to my use of the landline service. They responded saying "tough luck, all your phone sockets will become defunct and you will then only be able to plug a landline phone in through a single socket on the new router". I explained that this is totally useless to me, as I need landline access through sockets all around my property. They weren't interested and had not the slightest idea as to customers wishing to continue to use their multiple phone sockets. I asked if they could arrange for Openreach to investigate and do whatever necessary to save my phone sockets. Vodafone flatly refused saying "go away" and it is up to me to either solve this problem or just lose full access to my current landline phones.

I suspect I am not the only person (many of them not broadband users) in this country who has multiple landline phone sockets. Why is Vodafone apparently proposing to wreck my landline phone connections and telling me "tough luck, we're not interested in helping you solve your problem"?

[broadband_user]

>>>>However, my question remains:

>>>>- will a useful landline phone service be available that will allow customers to plug in telephones to live >>>>sockets located anywhere in their premises?

Hello,

You can enable all your internal phone sockets with a VOIP telephone service because I've done this at my house. I made a post about the same question (below) and was told I had to alter my wiring.

https://forum.vodafone.co.uk/t5/Landline/How-do-you-make-all-your-phones-ring-with-Vodafone-Digital-...

When Openreach came round to switch me over to Vodafone, they had to alter the wiring at the cabinet, so I asked him if he could wire my internal phones into the router, which he did. The Openreach guy added what looks like an ordinary telephone lead from the master socket that either:

1. Plugs back into the master socket (telephone port) if you have regular analogue telephone service (you don't) or,

2 Plugs into the VOIP lead that goes into your Vodafone router.

This 'flying telephone lead' is connected to your internal telephone wiring only - which terminates at the master socket. Before this lead was added, the internal phones were hard wired into the master socket and there was no way to get the connection into the back of the VOIP router - which is why Vodafone just tell everyone that 'you'll lose your internal phones'.

FYI, the Vodafone VOX3 router will ring at least 4 phones on its own, without the need for a REN booster - from my testing.

If your service has already been installed, you can just hire a 'telephone technician' from yellow pages to add the 'flying lead' for you. It shouldn't take more than 10 minutes to do. Your request should be to 'disconnect my internal phone wiring from the master socket and route it to a BT631A plug and 0.5m lead'. This will give you enough length to reach the router. I'm assuming here that you can move the VOIP router to within 0.5m of the master socket, which means you'll need a mains plug socket near by.

All the phones in my house ring now. No need to buy wireless phones, or run to the master socket each time the phone rings!

[broadband_user]

And just to add, if you would like to see how one home owner has done this wiring modification himself head on over to YouTube and search for 'Vodafone GigaByte Leave Existing Phones Disconnected'. 

From the looks of it, he's chopped the lead off an old telephone, and cut the single wire going into his master socket that feeds all his internal phones (*not* the line coming in from outside). He's then just spliced them together.

His wiring looks a bit rough and ready - it could do with a proper connector block - but you get the idea.

As it's all his own internal wiring that he's altering, it's also legal. You can do what you like to your internal phone wiring, provided you don't touch the wiring behind the master socket to the outside cabinet. Openreach get a bit upset if they find out you've touched that.

If you're not comfortable with the above, just call a technician and have them do it.

[ojos]

Thanks for the various responses. I have a few comments in reply:

1 Many people these days seem to assume that landlines are no longer relevant but I disagree because:

- while I too have access to mobiles I nornally leave them lying around the house in various places and don't casually carry them around. So when I receive an incoming call I don't 1 to run around the house from floor to floor stro locate them and risking injury due to a fall. My landlines handsets are all around the house and can be reached pretty much instantly.

- contrary to popular belief mobile coverage is not 100% and may fluctuate significantly.

2 Yes I do have access and use cordless phones but there is one significant problem for me:

All my landline handsets are mounted on the wall which ensures I know precisely where each one is whereas my cordless phones can only be placed on horizontal surfaces such as worktops. Further, each cordless phone has to be attached to a power point. So handset placement is far more convenient with non cordless handsets.

One significant potential problem with the new Voip technology is that, in the event of a power cut, you will no longer be able to use your landline phones. So in an emergency you may not be able to call for help. Burglars may be encouraged to cut off your power supply! Yes, sure, you may still be able to call for help with a mobile (allthough not everyone has them!), but for me I probably won't have enough time to run around my property to find my mobile and hope that the signal is strong.

I do feel that whoever has come up with this mandatory move to Voip hasn't considered all the above matters and should be urged address them.

[broadband_user]

You're worrying too much mate.

>>>All my landline handsets are mounted on the wall ..

Yes and you can still get them to ring for you like mine do. Just ask the Openreach technician to connect your internal phones up to the router. Cost me nothing.

>>>One significant potential problem with the new Voip technology is that, in the event of a power cut, you will no longer be able to use your landline phones. 

Does this happen a lot? If so buy a UPS. They're about 40 quid new. Generates mains from a rechargeable battery in the event of a power cut. You can buy them used for a tenner from EBay. Used a lot for desktop computers. Mass produced. Maintenance free.

>>>Burglars may be encouraged to cut off your power supply!

LOL. Unless they have a JCB then they won't be cutting your power cable as it comes in underground, and it's armored. If you see a JCB rolling up to your house, you have bigger problems to deal with than a dead mains supply (NLAW anyone?). If you have an outside meter then lock it, although if they're that determined to gain entry it'll only really be a matter of time...phone or no phone.

It's much easier to just cut the telephone line to a house if you want to burgle it as they nearly all terminate at a plastic grey BT junction box on the outside of your house - held together with one screw. Pair of scissors or pliers and .... no phone. Very little security. I did ask once if BT had anything more secure and was told - No.

>>>I do feel that whoever has come up with this mandatory move to Voip hasn't considered all the above matters and should be urged address them.

You can still buy a regular powered landline, it's just becoming less common, and more expensive.

After the 'switch off', just buy a UPS and put that in line with your router.

Fun factoid of the day for you. If you have access to someone else's grey BT junction box and they're on the older analogue telephone (non-VOIP), you can just unscrew the cover, press hold two wires on the connection block from a standard phone (with the white plug cut off) and start making outgoing premium rate calls. The victim gets charged and it's almost impossible to prove it wasn't the bill holder making the calls. There was a BBC documentary on this years ago. Not publicised too much as I guess they don't want too many people to copy it. You can even buy black market 'dongles' that fit inside the grey box to allow remote use of someone else's line. Calls are usually made at night when the householder is in bed asleep. VOIP stops all that. You'd need the correct router login details.

The only phone that's 'burglar' proof is a mobile with good reception. If you don't have good coverage then a land line will not save you. It's even more vulnerable to attack.

[Jayach]

Just to make it clear, the "traditional landline phone system". also known as POTS (Plain old telephone service) will not exist after December 2025. That has been decided, it will not be changed. (unless there is another "U" turn)

[ojos]

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@Jayach wrote:

Just to make it clear, the "traditional landline phone system". also known as POTS (Plain old telephone service) will not exist after December 2025. That has been decided, it will not be changed. (unless there is another "U" turn)

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Where is this decision published and who decided it, as I've not seen it published anywhere and no one I personally know is aware that this is going to happen. Rumours on this community suggests it may happen to the traditional BT phone system (which includes Vodafone) but I want to see it formally documented.
However, what about Virgin Media cable lines which are totally separate to, and not part of the, BT phone system? Are Virgin Media part of this decision to wipe out people's home landlines or are they able to keep this useful service going for their customers?

I am very much reminded of the days when cordless phones were first made available to people in this country. BT, who at the time operated the only landline system, published a clear warning to all customers saying:

Customers should always maintain at least one traditional (non-cordless) phone in their premises for making emergency phonecalls when there is a local power cut. This is because the BT line will continue to supply power to (non-cordless) handsets to make and receive phonecalls.

Consequently I recommend people to follow this advice, so why has that advice now been discarded leaving customers helpless during power cuts?

[Jayach]

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@ojos wrote:
Where is this decision published and who decided it, as I've not seen it published anywhere and no one I personally know is aware that this is going to happen.

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The UK’s PSTN network will switch off in 2025 | BT Business

Edit: Ofcom's statement

Upgrading landlines to digital technology – what you need to know - Ofcom

[Jayach]

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@ojos wrote:
1 What about the millions of people who don't have broadband installed? Will they be forced to pay for an unwanted broadband service just to enable them to make & receive landline class?

It is my understanding they will *probably be supplied with a VoIP adapter which will run on whatever Openreach infrastructure is available at their premises at the time, be that either fibre, or is some cases still copper.

Edit:

* I don't believe the exact method has been decided yet (there is still 3 years to go). but they will not be left without a service.

Some of the conversion from copper to fibre has been slowed whilst it is decided how to handle the requirement for "always on" connections for medical monitors and such like.